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Discussion in 'General Warriors Discussion' started by mt.wellington, Sep 3, 2017.
Yeah he's probably not big enough to play on the wing here thankfully.
Worst season ever for me;
- no redeeming factors in sight
-team went backwards
-gave up watching games for a while
-just boring boring style of play, it's not like it got us any better results
Next year might be even worse?
Might be the final nail in the coffin for me
Worse season ever, worse than 2004, don't argue with stats this one really hurt.
First season to really challenge long term support.
Truly can't see any light at the end of the tunnel.
Don't care about our reputation for sacking Coaches, sack him he's shit.
Hard to watch, hard to believe and the club has simply imploded.
And they wanted us to Keep the Faith and be a True Warrior!! FFS.
We would all like to hope 2018 is better , time will tell , you have to give SK one more season.
I think I will give the season a very generous capital C, because they're all a bunch of cun...... ning bastards, because they bloody fooled me like every other year.
Mannering, Gavet, RTS, Fus and to a lesser extent SJ were decent.
Klokstad, Satae, Papalii, Roache all showed they have the potential to maybe be first graders.
Too many poor players to name them all, could write a novel.
If I see Kata/Maumalo as 4/5 for the first teamlist for next season. It will cement Kearneys spot on the top rung, as the thickest plank that has ever held a head coaching role. Or if Bunty is a starting right edge rower, or any other out of position stupidity that this bloke is capable of coming up with.
I'd just like to raise a toast for the upcoming "Toughest pre-season ever". May it be as gruelling as the last 6!!!
Regressed*? Soz to correct you bro, but I think this is the word you're looking for. But I digress... Definitely agree with your assessment, been a horrible season.
Yeah totally agree with you bro... Dude's been invisible, it's almost as if he didn't even show up last night .
- makes promises he can't keep 'we'll definitely make the finals', 'if we don't make the finals I'll quit'
- signed high profile players and coaches to gain publicity and an ego boost instead of solid, dependable guys that we desperately needed
- has underestimated the job required to turn the club around
- his accent kinda bugs me a little
- sorted out the team's stadium issues
Football Advisory Board
(didn't hear f*** all about the board since they were announced )
- isn't getting the best out of his players
- has implemented an ineffective and unsuitable game plan
- has continually picked out of form players (albeit depth is an issue)
- isn't forthcoming with his view/opinion on how the team's going
- improved completions
- is clearing out players perceived to be 'slack'
- is easing his rookies into FG slowly and steadily
- tried a little too hard at times (not really sure why I'm saying this one's a negative, wish some of our other players would try as hard as the cap does)
- probably isn't as stern with the players as I'd like, wouldn't mind seeing him give someone an absolute spray for doing something wrong
- always does his best for the team and leads with his actions
- communicates with the referees well
- the vast majority showed little to no effort or desire to win
- they never learnt from their mistakes
- played dumb far too often
- rookies looked solid when they came into FG
- haven't signed any notable props
- looks like we're having trouble signing anyone atm
- brought in good replacements (upgrades imo) for Lolohea and Clarke
- managed to get in early and sign Harris before he could realise how shit we are
- re-signed Johnson for more than he's worth imo
- lost Matulino and Sipley (might have been the right choice depending on price and who we end up with, will have to wait and see)
- re-signed Sao who I don't rate (could be worth it if he's on a cheap salary)
- re-signed Gavet, Ayshford, Lino, Ata and Ayshford, all of whom I like
- let Gubb go (nothing against him personally I just feel like he's not progressing with us)
- didn't re-sign Foran (although we wanted him to stay at first I think in hindsight it's better that he's leaving. If he had stayed he would have taken up a huge chunk of our cap and probably wouldn't have paid it back given his form while being away from his kids)
- the U20's are struggling (not such a bad thing considering how much younger they are)
- still don't have an answer for the gap in aus v nz development pathways
- the better players are being moved up to reserves where they can learn more
- exposes young kids (17-18yo) to life as a professional footballer which should help us identify the cream of the crop earlier on
- like every season the Warriors looked like they were slower, less fit and less powerful than their opposition (whether or not this is due to fitness or something else like motivation or diet I'm not sure)
- at times the reserve players looked like they really struggled with the speed of FG (not really something to complain about, it almost always takes time for players to get up to FG speed)
- ran the water pretty well I guess
- took all the necessary precautions whenever a player seemed to get a head knock (you don't wanna be one of those clubs that gets called out for letting their concussed players continue playing)
- looked like players came back from injuries fit and ready
- didn't give the board members concussion tests when they decided that they'd hire Kearney... chooges chooges im just playin
Overall I give the club an A+ because I'm a hopeless lifetime supporter who'll never learn
A+ to the lady who sits in the coaches box though.
I don't know what the hell she does but probably the only thing keeping people from attempting to set Kearney on fire.
Just a pure DNF (Did Not Finish; emphasis on F) for me.
This was the season that finally broke me of the urge to watch games live. I followed via the forum and watched a few of our wins, but for the most part, I've cut the cancer that is this club out of my life.
I'll probably trick myself into watching round 1 next year, see the massacre, and then go back to not watching.
Still feel like 2012 was the worst, as they crashed from a grand finalist to near the bottom and young starters like Packer and Locke who could have been mainstays started going off the rails.
Maloney gave up, Luck broke down, Mateo starting getting fat, Johnson stalled in development, they made poor Manu captain for a few weeks, it was grim. At least this year you knew from the last couple that this team isn’t that good, in 2012, you literally just saw them in the grand final! Beat the Storm in Melbourne to make it!
Guess you could say look at these future stars like Hurrell and Ben Henry, unfortunately that year seems to be the start of the rot continuing today.
I think the club is at its all time lowest ebb
Coach Kearney blames the under-development of the Warriors juniors for the main sides' poor showings.
Ryan Hoffman who is leaving say the Warriors train damm hard, but blames a lack of talent..At Present
But believes the Warriors will improve once the youngsters get better.
So "Keep the Faith" guys.. Things will get better... Cannot get worse..or can it ?
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Coach Stephen Kearney says the Warriors must get better at "developing our talent" to arrest their NRL slide.
The Warriors' first grade team slumped to a record ninth straight loss on Sunday to end a disappointing first season in charge for Kearney.
Despite boasting an all-Kiwi test spine and going into the year as title fancies, they finished in 13th place to miss the top eight for a sixth straight year.
The presence of former New Zealand coach Kearney and superstars Roger Tuivasa-Sheck, Kieran Foran, Shaun Johnson and Issac Luke failed to have the impact so many of the club's supporters had hoped for.
The Junior Warriors - who have dominated the National Youth Competition since its inception with three titles and another grand final appearance - finished last in the National Youth Competition with just three wins.
"We've got ourselves to blame," Kearney said in Sydney after watching the Warriors lose 28-16 to Wests Tigers.
"There's no doubt about that. If you look at our NYC side, it's been beaten pretty comprehensively over the last month or so.
"We've missed the boat. We've taken our eye off the ball in developing that talent.
"When you have five coaches in seven years, I'm pretty sure that breeds some inconsistency."
The Warriors have lost five-eighth Kieran Foran, former skipper Ryan Hoffman and prop Ben Matulino for 2018 with Melbourne's Tohu Harris their only major recruit.
Asked what the club was doing to dig itself out of its hole, Kearney identified holding onto their best local talent.
"It's pretty complex in the sense that I don't think it's just one thing," Kearney said.
"We need to be better at developing our own talent. The clubs from over here [in Australia] go over there and get the talent and we've got to make sure we're better at that. That's a start.
"There are individuals in there that aren't quite ready for NRL and we've got to get players there that are."
Hoffman hits back
Departing Warriors forward Ryan Hoffman defended the club's culture, denying a lazy work ethic had set in.
Hoffman hit back at rumours of lackadaisical attitudes to training and a lack of professionalism that have dogged the franchise in recent years.
"Trust me, we train hard enough," he said.
"It's just at the moment we don't have blokes that are first-grade ready. That comes through the development and that sort of stuff. You can't be training players to be first-graders in first-grade.
"I think Steve's identified that, that there needs to be some improvement in the development of the juniors. They've won three 20s grand finals but we've got to make sure they're turning into first-graders."
Hoffman said he did not regret any of his time at the Warriors, which included one season as captain.
"It's a season of unfulfilled potential, I could argue we've had three years of that," he said.
Hoffman's future is uncertain and said he expected to make an announcement next week.
He is being courted by his former club Melbourne and has offers from several NRL and Super League clubs on the table, with the 33-year-old saying he would definitely play on in 2018.
"I'm pulling the boots on next year, don't you worry," he said.
Another poor season ends. From week 1 to 26, it's hard to see any improvement. Players looked to be going through the motions except for a few who are willing to be first graders.
Too many timid players who just sit back and show no initiative.
No support runners, no energy on D, no perseverance.
No sign of a plan from the coaching staff to improve matters.
For a lot of games our forwards achieved parity in the middle but our backs couldn't catch and pass in the attacking zone.
Our attack was clueless this year and coaching staff have got to take the blame for that.
Jim Doyle continues to be full of hot air and corporate speak. Every year the team gets worse under his watch.
Hope for next year: You do the same thing, you get the same result.
I think he has a point to an extent - Take Kata for an example he came straight from the U20s where defence was deemed optional into first grade where he's had to learn on the job. Ken M had to learn a whole new position after graduating from the U20s which is also pretty bizzare. With Allwood leaving next year the back-up centre options are going to be Pauga, who's only had 1 year in reserve grade and whichever U20s jersery-grabber gets retained.
I'm skipping the As, Bs and Fs, and heading right to the teachers' comments that nobody really likes to read.
I'm not usually a "glass half full" kind of guy (I'm usually too focused on finding the arsehole that drank half my Guinness), but as I sat down to rip in with much of the same as all the previous posts, I find myself in an oddly mellow mood about the Warriors. Listening to Radio Sport this morning Kev Walters (I think) said that we're paying the price for too many coaching changes and the attitude that some big-name signings would fix things here. They won't. Even Sterlo said at the start of the year that we wouldn't make the top 8, despite 'that spine', because there is long term work to endure here before we can enjoy real success.
Kearney, no matter what people thought/think of him, took over a steaming pile of crap. It takes time for that turd to sit in the sun and go hard. You can't yell at it to harden up. You can't show it a hard, dry turd and expect it to copy that turd and magic itself into something you can roll nicely into the shit-shovel. It's going to smear its shitty, smelly self all over the place, every time. And fuck a duck, we got smeared all over the paddock.
We haven't been utter shit for the entire season, despite it feeling like it, and despite us ending the year as a sloppier shit than any of us would have guessed. Dare I say I actually saw an improvement in some areas? The use of Mannering working with the halves, especially SJ created a lot of space on the right at times. It would have benefitted greatly from RTS running onto the ball there, but regardless, our right side looked the goods on attack. Hell, the work of Ayshford meant we looked reasonably good on defence there as well.
The style of play did degenerate into a boring, offload-free-zone, no question. But think back to the days when we'd rip our hair out over players making a line break and a great run, only to try and offload on tackle one, with three defenders on top of them. The days when we'd have a defence torn to shreds, only for someone to fuck the play up because they had white line fever. Calm heads? Fuck off, that's not our way. We fans were expected to settle for an exciting team that ultimately achieved five eights of fuck all. With ten minutes to go and a twelve point lead, we were just as likely to win by thirty as we were to lose by six. And fuck yeah, it was edge of the seat, pants-wettingly cool shit to watch. But got us nowhere, really.
Undoubtedly, we have players who shouldn't be in first grade. Players like Kata came up from the Baby Warriors with his only real asset being "he can run". In space, and against some of the softer NYC players, someone like that looks good. In the big boys' game, however, he's been found out. And strangely persisted with instead of being swapped for Allwood. I can only think that the reasoning is that we know how Kata will play to his strengths in the lower grades, and his weaknesses won't be as exposed, therefore he'll learn better in first grade. OK, so it's at the expense of fans hopes and dreams, but if that's the reasoning, I can understand it. There has to be some reason, right?
In retrospect, we were never going to be any good this year. Our top-four-at-the-end-of-the-year wanking over the spine was misplaced, my own grab-the-oil-and-box-of-tissues enthusiasm included. RTS was returning from a serious injury; Luke is, and always has been, too prone to going AWOL on the field and in his head; Foran was never, ever, ever going to be a force once he copped an injury, and he was always going to get injured; Shiny Johnson doesn't, and never has, stood up when it counts - flashes of game-winning brilliance for sure, but you can see the petulance and preciousness in his eyes when he's held to account for any failures. No ownership of flaws, there. One that that always surprises me when people talk about the spine is that they leave out the lock, one of the most valuable positions on the field. Our lock is the only vertebrae in our spine that was ever going to handle the rigours of NRL footy in 2017, although RTS did have a pretty good year it has to be said.
Outside of that spine, what did we have? A couple of seasoned second rowers, and a bunch of kids.
Like it or not, this year was the start of things, not the end. Kearney was always going to have to let players go, lance boils, and make them play boring shit to get solid fundamentals ingrained in players who should have had those fundamentals as a second nature by this stage of their career. Some of those bad habits are so deeply ingrained that there's no fucking way they're going away in a hurry. One of the biggest flaws is the lack of communication on field. Bodene Thompson telly yesterday said how he apologises to his team-mates for talking so much during in the game. For fucks sake, they all need to talk. And listen.
So the final "teachers' comment"... needs to work to reach their potential, and needs to talk more in class.
The polishing a turd part is were I'm at. Going to take a lot to drag us out of this hole, who knows if we have the players, coach, and club to do it.
Several teams have really let their fans down this season - Kimmorley
8:44 AM NZST
Brett Kimmorley ESPN NRL
When everyone sat down last week to go through the possible top eight combinations that the final round of NRL action could produce, most pencilled in a win for the Dragons over the Bulldogs. When the Sea Eagles accounted for the Panthers, it was pretty much assumed that the Cowboys would be missing the finals, paying the price for a bad run of injuries during 2017.
You could have forgiven the Cowboys for making their Mad Monday plans after the Panthers managed to stay ahead of them on for and against, but nothing is ever certain in this game. The Bulldogs played a great brand of football to upset the Dragons who had everything to play for and just couldn't produce the goods.
In the current game you need an active dummy half, you can't have your No.9 shovelling passes out and never threatening the defence with a running game. Lichaa showed how good he can be -- he has been vocal in blaming Des Hasler for restricting his natural game -- and I think he has saved his own career with his last few performances.
Also out of nowhere Will Hopoate transformed into a ball-playing fullback in the last few weeks, setting up tries on both sides of the field and even scoring a few of his own. They have been playing a flat game all year, with players catching the ball and going backwards to try and go forward. That all stems from not having a dummy half on the move, looking for opportunities to make quick metres and draw in defenders around the ruck. Once your No.9 goes forward, the halves and fullbacks get the ball on the front foot and can create things. The whole team started to look like the good football side they obviously can be.
I have a feeling that the Warriors don't work hard enough at training and it shows on the field. When the going gets tough they are just not competitive. It will take them at least 18 months of hard work to lift their game and I'm not convinced they are committed to doing that. Coach Stephen Kearney tried to put his foot down towards the back of the season, but it didn't work.
The season is over for these teams, who have underperformed for various reasons. There are eight teams remaining in the race for the premiership; the eight that deserve to be there and will give their fans at least another week to pull the colours on and cheer themselves hoarse.
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Pretty spot on about the warriors situation and culture
I’ve been thinking about the gameplan too, here’s a stat:
Even with this boring approach we scored 78 tries, 3.3 a game. Its not great, but cronulla in 5th and North Queensland in 8th also scored 78 tries.
The last time we were good in 2011 it was 88 tries (frankly it seems like we’ve missed out on that extra 10 just from not grounding the ball in goal)
The kicker is we conceded 98 tries, 4.1 a game, NQL are 77 (3.2 a game) Sharks 66, (2.8 a game)
In 2011 we conceded 71, 3.0 a game a record for the warriors.
Its always been defence holding us back, always.
The frustrating thing is that Ivan did something about that, backrowers in the centres etc, Kearney has not done that, keeps putting Kata out there to make bad reads and Ken legitimately just does not know what to do. There are other tunrstiles in defence too. Could make a highlight reel of Johnson running away from Yeo, RTS failing as the last line, Lisone gettting caught flat footed etc, etc.
Fix that and they’ll be competitive, continue to ignore it and we will never be any good, no matter how many offloads they chuck around.
You can’t just snap your fingers and have a defensive team, have to recruit players where that’s a strength, so I’m okay with Adam Blair (just don’t break the bank) and whatever boring ass center they can find who knows how to defend his position.
And it has to filter down to the juniors, but that will take forever.
I'd give Pass marks to CNK, DF, SM, JG, RTS.
I'd really like to give a pass mark to more, glass half-full etc, but no-one else deserves one.
SK: This is notice that the third year of his contract is as of now off the table and if he can't get us into the finals in 2018 he's goorne. Yes, good on him for getting the completion rates up (for all that we love "Warrior Ball", let's be honest, it gives us the shits when the team screw it up on tackle 2 and give the ball back in good position so they have to tackle more. High Risk, High Reward, High Annoyance...) but would it kill him to give some more attacking licence to at least some of the damn team?
Today, the club should be phoning potential coaching candidates on the basis that they should keep their 2019 options open bucause come August 2018 we just might be getting them to sign on the line for 2019.
JD has been too meh. Good on him for sorting out MSS, but he shoulda been harder with KF - am I the only one who'd have preffered seeing more of AH, with KF taking more of a mentor role? (which might have aided in his recovery etc)
Have to say I haven't been to MSS since late June due to a foot injury and I don't miss Pakuna Time/The Flava/The drums/The Sky City Cheer Team much at all. Can the club go back to having kid's league before the main game? Something relevant rather than fluff?
Dont you go hyping me up for next season you bastard!!!